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Skarlath
10-21-2005, 04:51 PM
I don't think that anyone can deny that the focus of most mainstream MMORPGs has continuously been combat. Apparently thats what the masses want. Well another trend in this is the traditional levelling system where kills=xp=improvement and therefore progression. A player enters the world, and continuously progresses through various lands and monsters, until they hit the cap on levels, or run out of content. All the while, it is the player moving, whilst the world remains the same.

A Tale in the Desert was something a little different. A game that was created solely for crafting and social interaction. It was a game to create communities, and because of the time players put into their community - spending time with other players and together crafting a settlement - many players have made it their home. By asking for dedication to player communities, it has achieved dedication to the game itself.

But why just one?! Are we gamers so bloodthirsty that after just one mainstream community-centric game, the market is already saturated? Is demand that low? I think World of Warcraft showed that there is definitely room for pulling gamers from other genres, and even non-gamers, into MMORPGs. I think that community centric MMORPGs still have quite a lifespan ahead of them.

So how do you all feel about them? A game where combat is not what everyone plays for. ATitD didn't feature combat at all, but what if a game simply focused on a community centic pivot, whilst allowing some players to assume combat orientated roles within a community.

How well would a game in which players had to actively manage an online village be recieved? Think guilds, but with player towns being the focus of the entire game. Players would need to hunt, gather and craft to improve their village. They will need to construct utility buildings, housing and defenses. They may want to expand their villages boundaries, and so would work together to construct new perimeters. They may wish to move the location of their guild/tribe to somewhere more advantageous, and so the whole village would work together to scout a new location, transport everything, and set up the village again.

All the while, NPCs would join the village, and work alongside the players. Players would take more leadership orientated roles in the community, but would also have to be organised into their own social structures. Players would work on understanding the game world and constantly improving their community in competition with other communities and with the environment itself.

Rather than progression through the game being around a player moving through the content, the players would bunch together and content would move around them. The game would be about social interaction and working as a large team.

Competition and progression would still be there, but would be in a vastly different way to what we see in current MMORPGs.


Over the last week or so, I have been playing with thoughts about a game I have been inventing. Running over what might work, what might not. What might be fun, how things could work. My game is set in a semi-prehistoric (with many liberties taken) setting, but what I posted this to discuss can refer to many settings.

What do people feel about the future of community Centric MMORPGs?

hawnz
10-21-2005, 05:30 PM
I don't think that anyone can deny that the focus of most mainstream MMORPGs has continuously been combat. Apparently thats what the masses want. Well another trend in this is the traditional levelling system where kills=xp=improvement and therefore progression. A player enters the world, and continuously progresses through various lands and monsters, until they hit the cap on levels, or run out of content. All the while, it is the player moving, whilst the world remains the same.

A Tale in the Desert was something a little different. A game that was created solely for crafting and social interaction. It was a game to create communities, and because of the time players put into their community - spending time with other players and together crafting a settlement - many players have made it their home. By asking for dedication to player communities, it has achieved dedication to the game itself.

But why just one?! Are we gamers so bloodthirsty that after just one mainstream community-centric game, the market is already saturated? Is demand that low? I think World of Warcraft showed that there is definitely room for pulling gamers from other genres, and even non-gamers, into MMORPGs. I think that community centric MMORPGs still have quite a lifespan ahead of them.

So how do you all feel about them? A game where combat is not what everyone plays for. ATitD didn't feature combat at all, but what if a game simply focused on a community centic pivot, whilst allowing some players to assume combat orientated roles within a community.

How well would a game in which players had to actively manage an online village be recieved? Think guilds, but with player towns being the focus of the entire game. Players would need to hunt, gather and craft to improve their village. They will need to construct utility buildings, housing and defenses. They may want to expand their villages boundaries, and so would work together to construct new perimeters. They may wish to move the location of their guild/tribe to somewhere more advantageous, and so the whole village would work together to scout a new location, transport everything, and set up the village again.

All the while, NPCs would join the village, and work alongside the players. Players would take more leadership orientated roles in the community, but would also have to be organised into their own social structures. Players would work on understanding the game world and constantly improving their community in competition with other communities and with the environment itself.

Rather than progression through the game being around a player moving through the content, the players would bunch together and content would move around them. The game would be about social interaction and working as a large team.

Competition and progression would still be there, but would be in a vastly different way to what we see in current MMORPGs.


Over the last week or so, I have been playing with thoughts about a game I have been inventing. Running over what might work, what might not. What might be fun, how things could work. My game is set in a semi-prehistoric (with many liberties taken) setting, but what I posted this to discuss can refer to many settings.

What do people feel about the future of community Centric MMORPGs?

sounds like a combination of "the sims" and an RTS, except we're the villagers in the RTS instead of the general/hero.

personally, i play MMORPGs for the combat, items, leveling up, etc. i don't like crafting and other menial tasks, so something like ATITD doesn't really interest me. however, i think it does interest a lot of other people, so i'm all for it if other people want to play it. i just won't be one of them.

Skarlath
10-21-2005, 05:44 PM
sounds like a combination of "the sims" and an RTS, except we're the villagers in the RTS instead of the general/hero.

personally, i play MMORPGs for the combat, items, leveling up, etc. i don't like crafting and other menial tasks, so something like ATITD doesn't really interest me. however, i think it does interest a lot of other people, so i'm all for it if other people want to play it. i just won't be one of them.

Not even if your role in the community could be purely combat based?

You could be the one to lead hunting parties to gather meat and hides. You could be the one slaughtering nearby nasties that might threaten the village. You could be the one defending leading the defense when a huge create is battering your perimeter walls down. You could be the one who leads raids into other villages, NPC and perhaps player, to take prisoners for labour and steal supplies and livestock.

You still have your item progression - as your community develops you will be able to produce better weapons. Weapons suited to different situations. And through their use you would learn new ways of using them.

We should assume that just because the game is community centric, it doesn't mean it is to the detriment of the combat system. Assume that combat is fun, involving and includes a good deal of progression to reach the top of your game.

There are lots of places where combat would fit into a semi-prehistoric community. Would you not be happy at all filling these roles?

I think you are right, it wouldn't be for everyone. Community centric games would attract those to whom community is vitally important. Those who already spend large amounts of time with their guild.

Finally, I would very much like people to shrug off the 'Sims' outlook on everything that involves anything that hints at mundane details. You wouldn't liken ATitD to the Sims, just because both involve building, would you? People too freely play the 'Sims' card, and it doesn't really contribute much to the discussion.

Therian
10-21-2005, 06:58 PM
Skarlath, are you talking about this in context of Vanguard's player cities? Because a lot of what you've described appears to be what is being aimed at in Vanguard.

Diplomacy, it seems to me, is going to attract a few Civilisation players.

Skarlath
10-21-2005, 07:03 PM
Skarlath, are you talking about this in context of Vanguard's player cities? Because a lot of what you've described appears to be what is being aimed at in Vanguard.

Diplomacy, it seems to me, is going to attract a few Civilisation players.

Oh, no no no. I am talking about a game which is based on a very different 'progression' system, in that you spend your time in, around and for your village.

Sure, Vanguard is intended to encourage communities, and player towns will require coordination of efforts for different roles. However I do not doubt that these roles will not be every part of running an actual village - they will be the skimmed surface so that players can enjoy them whilst progressing through the games 'actual' content.

Vanguard is still a combat centric MMORPG in my eyes. I can't wait for the diplomacy system, and crafting will be pretty damn good. But the design of the game, the way you progress through it is still in the same form as previous MMORPGs.

What I am talking about is having an entire game revolve around player settlements, rather than having them as an offshoot of gameplay.

Nath'aal
10-24-2005, 08:19 PM
I think I get the general gist of what you are talking about, and personally I would probaly play a game like this. However, making a game that matches the ideals you are proposing and making it appealing to enough people that it can sustain itself represents a huge hurdle to overcome. First of all, I think you cannot market it as an MMORPG, at least not any more than ATitD or the Sims is marketed as an MMORPG. Then you get into specific questions in the design process that will force you to make sacrifices that may fundamentally change what you want to accomplish. All that said, if you want to further explore ideas for this on a theoretical basis, I'm game.