fellowships

[kjjjjjjk]

hey so whatever happened to fellowships? i heard they were thrown in last friday but i havent heard anything about them in-game yet... if they are already ingame then how do you make one >_>

[Chae668]

hey so whatever happened to fellowships? i heard they were thrown in last friday but i havent heard anything about them in-game yet... if they are already ingame then how do you make one >_>
on test server.

[Apoco]

They were never sent live.

[imready2go]

They were never sent live.

And when the fired devs started posting comments the other day, one seemed to hint that fellowships would never make it to live - they were going to be dumped completely. Though if replaced by SoE's mentoring system, that would be better anyway.

[Murf]

Though if replaced by SoE's mentoring system, that would be better anyway.
QFT

[Defmetal]

Fellowships were a good enough idea.... who cares if people abuse it? you don't have to.
If they don't abuse fellowships they will simply abuse the EXP things.

If its a selling point of the game don't take it away.

[Gecon]

Sorry, but how exactly would one abuse a fellowship ?

[Zastapth]

Sorry, but how exactly would one abuse a fellowship ?

Levelling someone who doesn't have to be present playing the game is just asking for trouble. Imagine selling a levelling service based on fellowship where a high level just goes out and plays the game solid on his own account while you reap the rewards...it'd be almost impossible to prove there was cheating.

I was not aware of Mentoring until I read about it but it sounds a much better option. A player of a higher level may reduce his own effective level temporarily to match yours and help you out. His gear, spells and abilities are all reduced to compensate and it's just like having someone of this level present, not say someone who is 10 levels above and out of your exp gain range.

I need look no further personally.

[Cobalty2004]

There is a Brotherhood tab on live... doesnt do anything though

[Gecon]

So basically: Mentoring is something completely different than Fellowships, and while Fellowships would make sense, Mentoring would be basically a wasting time with Newbies, where neither you nor them get much of an advantage from it.

And the very idea is so complicated (delevel a characters abilities) that it wont be implemented, ever, anyway.

At least thats what I understand from your explanations.

[Flipsyde]

So basically: Mentoring is something completely different than Fellowships, and while Fellowships would make sense, Mentoring would be basically a wasting time with Newbies, where neither you nor them get much of an advantage from it.

And the very idea is so complicated (delevel a characters abilities) that it wont be implemented, ever, anyway.

At least thats what I understand from your explanations.

Actually, it was a lot better than you describe. Lets take my situation for instance.

My wife cannot play as often as I do. If I were to mentor her when she could play, she would get:

a) A high level player who already knows the ins and outs of his game.

b) A player who could point her in the direction of the next good quest for her to do.

c) all the exp and none of the grey-ness.

It benefits me (I get to sleep in my own bed instead of the couch) and it benefits her.

In fact, mentoring has a lot of benefits and very few downsides. The biggest downside is that the high level player is limited to what they could do at the level of the player they are mentoring (ie a 50 DK mentoring a 30 cleric could only cast spells and use abilities that a lvl 30 DK could use).

[klondorwarrior]

So basically: Mentoring is something completely different than Fellowships, and while Fellowships would make sense, Mentoring would be basically a wasting time with Newbies, where neither you nor them get much of an advantage from it.


Um, wrong. The person "mentoring" the "newbie" is getting the benefit of leveling his/her friend up to their level. The person being "mentored" gets the benefit of another person to duo with, giving them a SIZABLE exp/hour boost (HUGE boosts if the class is one of the traditional "suckass" solo classes,) and a literal VG mentor to show them the ropes IN their group who DOESN'T suck up their exp.

[Sait]

Ummm Fellowships would work like Groups work so if yu are in a fellowship with someone who is not within your level range 6 levels i think it is they wont get XP ..

Mentoring is worse for power leveling as you get a group of 6 people you have one max level chr all the best geer he mentors down and groups up sets Auto follow on his 5 chrs so they just follow him around and he destroys mobs that would normaly take a full group to kill and powers through the levels.

I see it so much in EQ2 where you will have one guy running around with 5 chrs on Auto follow just powerleveling them all ...

Wish Fellowships you would still have to level 1 chr up and the more chrs attached to the fellowship the less XP you get .. so there is no short cuts with it. or alot less.

:D

[Gecon]

It benefits me (I get to sleep in my own bed instead of the couch) and it benefits her. Huge advantage. For you.

So I dont see I have understood anything wrong about mentoring, so I havent changed my opinion at all, and my last posting still fully applies. You get nothing from it and the other party gets hardly anything from it.

Why dont you just make 2 characters btw ? One to play with your wife, the other to solo. You can even make the one playing with your wife a healer, while the other might be some Mage, or a Dread Knight or Paladin - some easily soloable class, and you might make him crafter and/or diplomat, too, so you can craft and diplo all over the world, while the character for party with your wife could be always where your wifes character is.




In fact, mentoring has a lot of benefits and very few downsides. The biggest downside is that the high level player is limited to what they could do at the level of the player they are mentoring (ie a 50 DK mentoring a 30 cleric could only cast spells and use abilities that a lvl 30 DK could use). And at the same time I also have to go through the hassle of reordering my hotkeys completely for that lower level. The idea alone is painful.




a literal VG mentor to show them the ropes IN their group who DOESN'T suck up their exp. Yeah thats indeed an advantage, but its not worth it. With Fellowships I could login and play. Granted, I level more slowly, but I can just play. In contradiction, with mentoring, I have to repeat quest I've already done, just to level someone faster. The very idea sucks big time and is limited in its usefulnes to the described "husband wants to sleep in bed and not on sofa" scenario.

[Defmetal]

The whole point of fellowships is that they are static parties.
People in FFXI always tried to make them because of how long leveling took. But they always break because one guy logs in early and gains like two levels and breaks the static party.

Fellowships solve this problem, where no matter who logs in, everyone is leveling up.

You people are so one sided, you only see how it can be abused but you can't see how it could be useful.

Mentoring isn't a bad idea, it helps pros mentor new players... hence the term mentor.

However that doesn't mean we should get one or the other. What if neither of you are a pro? What if you and another friend join the game together at the same time, and want to log in together? What if the other can't log in, you should quit playing until he can to sync exp?

Screw that ... fellowships are a great idea and should remain and be exactly what was promised.


RMT can not do fellowship exp any easier then they could do what they do right now. I mean they have to be in the level range anyways ... it's not like a level 50 can go power level a level 1.... any easier if they were online or offline.

The only bad thing about fellowships right now is that Vanguard is incredibly easy to level up, almost don't need them. The idea behind Vanguard was that it was gonna take average players months and months to hit 50, instead of weeks, and thats why fellowships were important, to keep you sync'd up for the long journey.

I'm not gonna go mentor myself and get 0 exp just so someone else can, even if they are my friend, i'd much rather us just be the same level to begin with, and thats why we need to keep fellowships but NOT be close-minded to mentoring.

[shadowrelm]

mentoring is much better. with the fellowship, the person doing the leveling gets reduced experience.

the mentoring system in EQ2 is a good, proven concept.

the only problem with it, as with any forced grouping game, is now when hi bys level their alts, they just double box with their main. it means even less grouping at lower levels, and it saves them from having to level up a second and third alt they are not really interested in.

mentoring is less flawed in concept than the fellowship system which works great in EQ2.

the problem in Vanguard isnt leaving friends behind, its getting people to group to begine with. same with EQ2.

[StabbyMcGee]

I'm not sure. I think quite a few people play with friends, I know when I bounce between WoW/EQ2/Vanguard I have at least two friends playing with me, sometimes more than that. By using a fellowship we can stay at the same level, Mentoring would also be a fantastic addition as well, don't get me wrong. But why not have both?

Both seem to be good features, would both work well and it would help strengthen the somewhat small player community. Both systems can be abused slightly, but it's not a big enough cause to not have 'em.

[Gecon]

mentoring is much better. with the fellowship, the person doing the leveling gets reduced experience. With mentoring, you get NONE.

[Chae668]

a previous thread had a link to a discussion with the plans for VG's future. they are bringing in the fellowships.

if you have 6 peeps in your fellowships, 1/6 of the total xp is distributed equally to the members.

no word on mentoring. maybe this can help clarify the discussion.

[Kaltor]

In fact, mentoring has a lot of benefits and very few downsides. The biggest downside is that the high level player is limited to what they could do at the level of the player they are mentoring (ie a 50 DK mentoring a 30 cleric could only cast spells and use abilities that a lvl 30 DK could use).

Now, it could have changed since i last logged into EQ2(KoS era), but when I played and used the mentoring system it lowered the mentoring character down to the lvl of who they were mentoring. Yes it lowered their abilities effectiveness, but you could still use ALL spells you have recieved. Example. Even though a necro doesnt recieve Death touch at like 48 or 50, if he has the skill he can still mentor down to lvl 15 or whatever and still use that skill.... its just scaled down to the appropriate lvl. Also while mentoring, the person who is being mentored gets a small xp boost, and the person who is mentoring gets an xp penalty that ranges from like 5% - 90% depending on level difference.

One of the greatest things I loved about the mentoring system is it made it so no raid was obsolete. Say expansions come out and everyone lvls and turns their favorite dungeon grey. so you just have people mentor down to someone who is appropriate lvl and now you can raid that place again, since the mobs are no longer grey.

yes i know you ask "Why would we go back since we have new content?", because Its nice to have the option to do old dungeons again.

[Katrasle]

Now, it could have changed since i last logged into EQ2(KoS era), but when I played and used the mentoring system it lowered the mentoring character down to the lvl of who they were mentoring. Yes it lowered their abilities effectiveness, but you could still use ALL spells you have recieved. Example. Even though a necro doesnt recieve Death touch at like 48 or 50, if he has the skill he can still mentor down to lvl 15 or whatever and still use that skill.... its just scaled down to the appropriate lvl. Also while mentoring, the person who is being mentored gets a small xp boost, and the person who is mentoring gets an xp penalty that ranges from like 5% - 90% depending on level difference.

One of the greatest things I loved about the mentoring system is it made it so no raid was obsolete. Say expansions come out and everyone lvls and turns their favorite dungeon grey. so you just have people mentor down to someone who is appropriate lvl and now you can raid that place again, since the mobs are no longer grey.

yes i know you ask "Why would we go back since we have new content?", because Its nice to have the option to do old dungeons again.

stop surfing the internet at work

[Kaltor]

stop surfing the internet at work

Hey I can't really do much while the computer is using all the resources to process books.

P.S. Don't you have more lvls to get with your Friday off!

[elorei]

With mentoring, you get NONE.

Why? Because you say so?

[Nitefang]

With mentoring, you get NONE.

you have obviously never played EQ2 then - because this is patently false - in EQ2's Mentoring system, both the mentor and the one being mentored get xp, the mentor is giving the lower player a "bonus" to xp above what they would get soloing - and while doing so, has his abilities scaled down - no changing of stuff on your hotbar - you can still do everything you ever could - just at a reduced effectiveness.

mentor - gets xp
mentored person gets bonus xp
mentors existing abilities are reduced in power while mentoring

hope this clarified things for you, as I hate to see misinformation causing people to be negative about something for the wrong reasons - like it or dont, but at least dislike it for accurate reasons.

[Flipsyde]

Actually, Gecon, I do have an alt I am leveling up to play with my wife. However, my shaman is not as much fun to me as my DK. Thats why I would rather mentor than reroll. But who knows, my first ever toon was a shaman in EQ...maybe I will roll that way now that I am 50.

Kaltor - I could be wrong. It has been a couple of years since I played and I quit just before the major CU and Crafting updates. I thought they made it so you couldn't use your abilities that would be above your mentoring level. If it has changed, I stand corrected.

Meh, I will help my wife level with whatever the game puts in place. I was just trying to add to the discussion with what I already (or thought I already) knew.

[Danni]

you have obviously never played EQ2 then - because this is patently false - in EQ2's Mentoring system, both the mentor and the one being mentored get xp, the mentor is giving the lower player a "bonus" to xp above what they would get soloing - and while doing so, has his abilities scaled down - no changing of stuff on your hotbar - you can still do everything you ever could - just at a reduced effectiveness.

mentor - gets xp
mentored person gets bonus xp
mentors existing abilities are reduced in power while mentoring

hope this clarified things for you, as I hate to see misinformation causing people to be negative about something for the wrong reasons - like it or dont, but at least dislike it for accurate reasons.

Also, Gecon mentioned that he wouldn't like to have to remap his spell bar every time he mentored. This used to be the case a long time ago, but was fixed. You keep your spell bar as is, and just use them as normal.

The other benefit to being a mentor is that you get the chance to gain loot from named mobs that would not have dropped anything due to the TLC.

I agree - you need to have experience of the mentoring system before you can start trying to kick it.

[Sickpuppy]

The EQ2 mentor system was awesome....nuff said. High levels who mentored down could also completely rape face. I remember grouping with a raid geared 70 wizard mentoring down to ~25ish. He tore the dungeon apart so hard it was funny. I guess it means you level a lot faster with a high level mentoring you (not just because of the bonus XP).

[Bhima_LS]

You people are so one sided, you only see how it can be abused but you can't see how it could be useful....
Thank you. Thank you for being a voice of sensibility (along with a couple of other voices here).

I came from ten years of Ultima Online where anybody could group with or hunt with anybody, and one of the reasons Vanguard is so weak on community is that you can't group with people more than a few levels different than you.

Last night, for instance, I was on my 19th level cleric grouped with a really nice band of people I'd met a few times. They were ranging in level 13 to 16, and they were dying a lot, so I joined them at that place full of 4-dot 15's and 4-dot 18's. In four or five months in Vanguard, this was one of the best groups I've been in (at one point when we all wiped, the 13th level disciple managed to stay out of the wipe and come back and rez me, and we all recovered).

And then I hit 20th level, and I had to leave the group, because if I had stayed, the 13th level guy wouldn't have been able to gain XP.

This kinda stuff happens all the time. I have lots of characters I love to play, but I can't play them with my friend whom I came over with from UO, because his sorcerer is 29th level now, and my best character is 26th level and all the rest 15 to 20.

Anything that lets people play with each other regardless of level is a good thing for the game, and who gives a crap about services people might pay strangers. It will help make and keep friends by letting people play together.

[Poke]

Thank you. Thank you for being a voice of sensibility (along with a couple of other voices here).

I came from ten years of Ultima Online where anybody could group with or hunt with anybody, and one of the reasons Vanguard is so weak on community is that you can't group with people more than a few levels different than you.

Last night, for instance, I was on my 19th level cleric grouped with a really nice band of people I'd met a few times. They were ranging in level 13 to 16, and they were dying a lot, so I joined them at that place full of 4-dot 15's and 4-dot 18's. In four or five months in Vanguard, this was one of the best groups I've been in (at one point when we all wiped, the 13th level disciple managed to stay out of the wipe and come back and rez me, and we all recovered).

And then I hit 20th level, and I had to leave the group, because if I had stayed, the 13th level guy wouldn't have been able to gain XP.

This kinda stuff happens all the time. I have lots of characters I love to play, but I can't play them with my friend whom I came over with from UO, because his sorcerer is 29th level now, and my best character is 26th level and all the rest 15 to 20.

Anything that lets people play with each other regardless of level is a good thing for the game, and who gives a crap about services people might pay strangers. It will help make and keep friends by letting people play together.


Fellowships do not help in your situation. Fellowships are worthless.