crafting complications galore

[melder]

Since the patch this morning its not just me being unlucky right, ther has been a massive increase in the amount of complications during crafting. I was truly enjoying crafting but this is taking the fun out of it in a pretty big way. Is anyone else having the same problem, i saw nothing of this in the patch notes.

[Inqubus]

Since the patch this morning its not just me being unlucky right, ther has been a massive increase in the amount of complications during crafting. I was truly enjoying crafting but this is taking the fun out of it in a pretty big way. Is anyone else having the same problem, i saw nothing of this in the patch notes.

14 Outfitter here, and yes, complications are through the roof. Averaging 4-6 comps per item, making Grade C a thing of the past, and just making the item at Grade D a real struggle.

Hope they get this fixed soon. Was going to go on crafting spree tomorrow. :cry:

[Selwyn]

Tried some work orders, could not see problem with "moderate" ones but..
At "dificult" tasks; (first try) well, got 5 compli. one after other.. stuck at 2nd stage, hrm. Completed next item only with 2 complication
So, back to work.. to test it more

[Inqubus]

I was getting the 4-6 comps on Moderate WO's on the same WO's I was doing right before the patch, where I would get 1, 2 and 3 max.

May just be specific trade related? I don't have any other crafting trade characters to test it on. Several items I would have 3-4 just in the first half of Stage 2 (if there were 2 parts in the stage) or in Stage 2 if it was alone. % gains seemed to be down as well a little bit, but I didn't pay very close attention to the % gains because of the comp rate.

[Arcalus]

I'm getting 4-6 on every work order, no matter the difficulty.

Sometimes I get lucky with very easy and only get 2-3 comps.

I hope the Devs read this forum, I also petitioned, just so they know what's going on, I suggest you all do the same, the squeaky wheel gets the grease after all.

[Baseline]

I'm also getting complications through the roof on work orders with my 10 Artificer.

[belthize]

I've set up a thread in the VanguardCrafters issues forum to objectively document the delta in comp frequency before/after this latest patch.
Don't bother posting opinions of comps in general, feel free to do that in the Crafting Discussion forum :).

http://216.69.131.141/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=1549

The site admins are working on improving performace there, it's a bit better this morning .. hopefully even more so after this weekend.

More data would certainly help quickly isolate the nature of the problem if it is in fact not intended. I'm assuming it's not because so far the results are inconsistent.

There was a brief period where the site was non-responsive but it seems fine now, your mileage may be in kilometers.

Essentially what I asked there was for folks to list their
Level/trade
Parent skills (outfitter/blacksmith/artificer and sub specializations)
Process skills (station/utility/tool)
WO (or recipe) difficulty (easy/mod/difficult etc)
Effective frequency change (like seeing 2 more comps than yesterday, seeing same number, seeing 1 fewer etc).

If folks could do that I'll point back to here ... the devs do read that site so they'd see this post as well.

Thorsen Belthize

[kryshael]

13 tailor here and im getting 4-6 complications per w/o as well...on a moderate work order, i get lucky if i can finish with a D grade. I dont even try for a C and still completely fail the craft at least 50% of the time.

Really needs to be fixed today quickly or they will lost alot of new people who try out crafting today.

[Arthamaeus]

14th lvl outfitter/tailor here-- yes indeed something has changed. For the first time since a week ago I acually failed two difficult work orders in a row.

Also have failed refining cotton. Complications galore is correct. Definitely a challenge now. :D

[Brockhammer]

Lvl 15 Armorsmith, and yeah the complications have definately increased. I can still do all moderate WO's at a grade C or even B sometimes, but I am not risking going for B anymore since trying to squeeze that last little bump in quality has resulted in a failed WO several times because of a last second complication. All in all it hasn't affected my XP rate much, so I'm not all that concerned.

[Matuse]

Last night, I decided to grab the absolute lowest WO on the list..the one designed for 0 skill characters, and went at it with my Level 15 crafter. I wanted to see what effects there might be for doing maximum A quality on an entire 5-piece order.

First run through, I had -9- complications. No joke.

[Mydnyte]

This bug must still exist, unless I'm supposed to be getting 3 complications per stage on Easy WOs at level 12. Is this a "known issue" yet? Too many complications really makes crafting un-fun :(

[jwiv]

This bug must still exist, unless I'm supposed to be getting 3 complications per stage on Easy WOs at level 12. Is this a "known issue" yet? Too many complications really makes crafting un-fun :(

As far as I can tell, the fix they put in didn't have a positive effect.

[Revrick]

They definetly raised the amount of complications, and they get very frustrating. By raising your +crafting station use skill as much as possible, you can lower the frequency to *almost* acceptable rates. I get 4-5 complications on a high-moderate or low-diff work order combine. Enough to get consistant C's (and xp!).

I have 250 in my stitching, which is the skill crafting station use raises. Without my gear i have about 160, and i get almost twice the # of complications.

Also note however, they have raised the rate of "good" complications. They are not spectacular, but if you get an "obsessive" complication, every tick that the complication is up you get some quality. I average 13-17% quality gained. However, it raises action point cost by "low". i average 100-120 action points wasted from the complication, but 100-120 pts for 13-17% quality is AOK in my book.

[Tashan]

Also note however, they have raised the rate of "good" complications. They are not spectacular, but if you get an "obsessive" complication, every tick that the complication is up you get some quality. I average 13-17% quality gained. However, it raises action point cost by "low". i average 100-120 action points wasted from the complication, but 100-120 pts for 13-17% quality is AOK in my book.

Don't know if it is "good" complications.... I get Obsessive Smithing quite often and always have and usually it is after I have the quality where I want it and don't want to waste the added points. Admitedly they can be a boon if you get them early in the procedure, but if it's later on and you're tight on points already they can actually force you to fail.

[Corven]

Complications are definitely too high right now. It seems to be slightly crafting-specific too though; I changed from blacksmithing to outfitting and noticed less complications with outfitting.

I'm sure they're watching complication rates and will continue to adjust as needed.

[Tharzidun]

I am pretty sure it has to do with the "+ crafting station" use gear. They recently "lowered" its impact, which is how well it lowers the amount of complications. I tossed that gear long ago, and I have personally been dealing with more complications ever since (pre-"bug"). However, I am able to get C's on moderate WO's routinely, and if I care to try, I can get a B (I don't usually bother). I think its a matter of them fixing a real bug that we have all been benefiting from, and so it feels like a nerf.

[Revrick]

I am pretty sure it has to do with the "+ crafting station" use gear. They recently "lowered" its impact, which is how well it lowers the amount of complications.

Admittingly, i did not play in beta, but i have to disagree with this statement in regards to the release version of vanguard. I believe they raised the impact of the "+ crafting station use" gear, and raised the amount of base complications. I have 270(ish) in my station stats, and complications have been more than manageable. I do low difficult and high moderate WOs and always get C or B.

When i take off my gear to ensure that i'm sane, i notice a drastic increase in complications. When i reduce my station use by 70 or more, and replace that with tools and/or utils, i can barely get C's on the same work orders.

Though, i am only 18. You could be speaking of higher lvls.

[Riggin]

I am able to get C's on moderate WO's routinely, and if I care to try, I can get a B (I don't usually bother). I think its a matter of them fixing a real bug that we have all been benefiting from, and so it feels like a nerf.

I hope they aren't gunning for C-maybe-B quality on moderate items. The way I imagined it was this:
Very Easy - Should get A or 'flawless' consistently
Easy - A quality maybe a flawless in there sometimes or a rare B
Moderate - B quality consistently, with some fluctuation to low A or high C
Difficult - C quality, but could vary as much as one degree of quality

I had a thought though. Maybe they're trying to give crafters a 'death' factor in having things this difficult. The only way to penalize us crafters is to have some of our hard work become worthless with a D quality rating. Anyone else think this might be part of it?

[Revrick]

I hope they aren't gunning for C-maybe-B quality on moderate items. The way I imagined it was this:
Very Easy - Should get A or 'flawless' consistently
Easy - A quality maybe a flawless in there sometimes or a rare B
Moderate - B quality consistently, with some fluctuation to low A or high C
Difficult - C quality, but could vary as much as one degree of quality

I had a thought though. Maybe they're trying to give crafters a 'death' factor in having things this difficult. The only way to penalize us crafters is to have some of our hard work become worthless with a D quality rating. Anyone else think this might be part of it?

The only problem i can see with your mapping of grade to difficulty, is the amount of XP gained. If i got C's on all the highest difficulty orders(the ones at the very top), i would be lvling much faster than i am now. i think 'C' 'B' should be the aim for mods, and 'D' 'C' for difficults.

[jonyak]

I hope they aren't gunning for C-maybe-B quality on moderate items. The way I imagined it was this:
Very Easy - Should get A or 'flawless' consistently
Easy - A quality maybe a flawless in there sometimes or a rare B
Moderate - B quality consistently, with some fluctuation to low A or high C
Difficult - C quality, but could vary as much as one degree of quality

I had a thought though. Maybe they're trying to give crafters a 'death' factor in having things this difficult. The only way to penalize us crafters is to have some of our hard work become worthless with a D quality rating. Anyone else think this might be part of it?

weird I get lots of complications, but I also regularly get my stuff up into the b-A range when I do difficuly items. and I'm only a level 7.

[Riggin]

The only problem i can see with your mapping of grade to difficulty, is the amount of XP gained. If i got C's on all the highest difficulty orders(the ones at the very top), i would be lvling much faster than i am now. i think 'C' 'B' should be the aim for mods, and 'D' 'C' for difficults.

That's kinda what I was thinking by saying maybe this is their way of giving crafters a 'death' of sorts. Could be that this is the way things are supposed to be?

[Gutdog]

Have to say I really like the game and prefer a more hardcore type game but the sheer amount of complications is just p*ssing me off at the moment. Take a risk whilst crafting to improve the quality of you item and one thing can be assured - you will be punished by complications and you will regret it.

Surely Sigil did not intend for crafting to be quite so annoying. I want challenge but I don't want to be thinking "this is just ridiculous"......

[ThreadKiller]

I have a question about complications. When you try to remove them, let's say they go down to 52%....does that mean that you will only get 52% of the reduction of the complication (which IMO, it should be). That way I can make an intelligent decision to continue with the complication or try to resolve it. I had many times when I've tried to remove the complication that takes 3 attempts (with the latst attempt only taking off 1 or 2%). If I knew that I was only going to get 1 or 2% of the reduction, I would choose to just leave it there.

does this make sense to anyone?

[Gutdog]

Yeah I understand what you are saying and it wold be good to know the answer.

[gcadays99]

Having complications is fine but when you get 9+ on a recipe thats 8 levels lower than your character that is just rediculous and ruins the game. I'm having troubles even completing some moderate level work orders without even doing anything to quality at lvl 19.

[gcadays99]

Guess my new favorite thing is when I actually try to get rid of a complication before I can 2 more pop up in its place. If I'm trying to fix a complication that should be immune to having more complications start.

[Revrick]

Guess my new favorite thing is when I actually try to get rid of a complication before I can 2 more pop up in its place. If I'm trying to fix a complication that should be immune to having more complications start.

Wow.. I have never had this happen.. If that was the case, i'd yell and scream too.. Have others had a complication come up while fixing a current complication?

I have heard multiple people say outfitters get less complications, i wonder if this could be the issue...

[LeviticusD]

Wow.. I have never had this happen.. If that was the case, i'd yell and scream too.. Have others had a complication come up while fixing a current complication?

I have heard multiple people say outfitters get less complications, i wonder if this could be the issue...


I've had that happen as an outfitter before. TBH, it sort of makes sense to me...when trying to fix something out of the ordinary, the chances of mesing something else up is higher...just ask anybody that has ever taken their car to a mechanic. :P

However, it is something I don't hope to see alot of.

[ThreadKiller]

i've been 3 deep in complications before, and often as an artificer

[dargath]

i've been 3 deep in complications before, and often as an artificer

yah its lovely when you get a pair of moderate -s on consecutive turns....

[wold]

yes I am lvl 10 blacksmith and lvl 7 outfitter-- I am getting lots of complications in each.

For some moderates I better settle for "C" or risk losing due to tons of complications, often 3 at a time.

A few days ago they announced they were "aware" of issues with crafting-- is it now "fixed"?

Are we going to have tons of complications all the time now?

One complaint I have is about quality complications. It seems to me if you get one, and fix" it, you should not get quality penalty during the repair, As it is you get 2 "hits" on quality just from the 35 point action cost "round" x2.

IN other words I don;t think fixing or repairing a complication should cost a whole turn worth of quality loss, but I can see how others would disagree. I just hate to see 3/4 of a grade wiped out while I repair.

[Erilyn]

Im a level 4 artificer ( I know, still a n00b crafter. Mainly due to being aggrevated by too many complications) and have noticed a huge increase in complications when making moderate items in WOs. I know they said they were aware of the problem and were fixing it, but....wheres the fix? I see a lot of things under crafting on patch notes, but none that say they lowered the amount of complications. On easy WOs, i get no complications. On moderate...they are continual.

Also, not sure if anyone else has had this problem, but I was doing a WO and set my table up with the required solvent, water for complication and emery. Well one complication called for emery, then another popped up for water, then another popped up for bandages. I cant set that many items up on my table so I was forced to quit that WO and lost the items I had used thus far in "trying" to make it.

I can understand there being complications, but cmon....this is just tedious, aggervating and makes very unenjoyable.

[Sorkvir]

I'm sorry. I just have to say this is frustrating to say the least.

I HOPE dev's read these posts. AT LEAST look at the number of people doing Work Order now. I can tell that there are drastically less (on my server at least). Not only are we fighting decrease table skills, but 3~4 complications that take at least 100pts or more to get rid of PER work order (moderate) is just stupid.

They've literally killed the enjoyment of work orders.

[Vidrak]

I'm sorry. I just have to say this is frustrating to say the least.

I HOPE dev's read these posts. AT LEAST look at the number of people doing Work Order now. I can tell that there are drastically less (on my server at least). Not only are we fighting decrease table skills, but 3~4 complications that take at least 100pts or more to get rid of PER work order (moderate) is just stupid.

They've literally killed the enjoyment of work orders.
Agreed, I want to craft some more tonight. I heard it was moderatlely better after last nights patch? Or is this not so? But yes, it has been slow going for about a week now ... be nice for this to get looked at, as I want to continue crafting without getting so discouraged.

[shamusmacgowan]

Agreed, I want to craft some more tonight. I heard it was moderatlely better after last nights patch? Or is this not so? But yes, it has been slow going for about a week now ... be nice for this to get looked at, as I want to continue crafting without getting so discouraged.

Not sure really. I spent a bit of time crafting late last night and I'm still noticing plenty of complications. They still need to do some work tuning the complications and the difficulty on them.

[Revolver Koala]

Not sure really. I spent a bit of time crafting late last night and I'm still noticing plenty of complications. They still need to do some work tuning the complications and the difficulty on them.
Definitely. Just now, I had a 5-item moderate WO to do; one time I got one complication the whole time, another I got three in a row on the same step. Like, the very next action I took after I cleared one got me another. Overall, I'm doing a lot better than I used to, at least in terms of the grade of items I'm making; still, complications tend to pop up way too much. As an aside, it's one of the most frustrating things in the world to get hit with a -quality when you're already past your quality step and there's nothing you can do about it :x

[shamusmacgowan]

Definitely. Just now, I had a 5-item moderate WO to do; one time I got one complication the whole time, another I got three in a row on the same step. Like, the very next action I took after I cleared one got me another. Overall, I'm doing a lot better than I used to, at least in terms of the grade of items I'm making; still, complications tend to pop up way too much. As an aside, it's one of the most frustrating things in the world to get hit with a -quality when you're already past your quality step and there's nothing you can do about it :x

Yes, that is infuriating.

[wold]

Yes, that is infuriating.

That is why I am saying that fixing the complication should not count as a "turn" in terms of deducting quality.

My reasoning is this: if you ignore a quality deducting complication and keep smithing, you should lose quality.

But, if you were smithing and got a complication, you would stop smithing and cure the complication.

It should cost action points but not act as a "turn" and deduct the same amount of quality as if you ignored it.

Im interested if anyone agrees with this.

[Taffy]

Yes, crafting is a chore.

Diplomacy has become a chore.

Harvesting I can do, as I can adventuring.

Guess I'm stuck with being an adventuring harvester until the stuff gets balanced correctly....

[Riggin]

That is why I am saying that fixing the complication should not count as a "turn" in terms of deducting quality.

My reasoning is this: if you ignore a quality deducting complication and keep smithing, you should lose quality.

But, if you were smithing and got a complication, you would stop smithing and cure the complication.

It should cost action points but not act as a "turn" and deduct the same amount of quality as if you ignored it.

Im interested if anyone agrees with this.

I'm with ya on this one wold. Good point!

-Riggin

[Vidrak]

Yea, I hit 19 last night. And it was pretty rough. Getting lots of complications in a row. And when I tried to make something, I would get smacked with 3-5 in a row.

I mean, seriously, how many flipping times can an anvil crack in 20 minutes? Right now, it is on the order of 15. Maybe you should put quests in where you can build better crafting stations, lol, right now, the compliations do not only seem rediculously hard, but totally unrealistic at the same time.

A mangled/broken tool on EVERY single refining recipe, this happens without a doubt. The tool still works fine after breaking 400 times or more?

And where are the helpful "complications" that were in beta? This helped us A LOT and made you feel good when they happened, like you were doing something right. All we have now is joy when we get C quality on a moderate, if you can do that, you are doing pretty good. I just don't get why this stuff was taken out!? This was a good, fun system before :(

The assembly table stuff is just gone now? This was a good idea, I liked it in beta, now just poof, gone forever?

I am just wondering wtf is going on with crafting right now. It just seems to be getting worse and worse and worse, and just less fun than it was in Beta 3 even.

[Vyvian Vycious]

I'm just a level 4 Artificer however I have to say that if I stick to the easy work orders, it's very rare to get a complication. However, if I move up in difficulty at all, the complications kill me and I'm unable to complete any items.

I enjoyed crafting in EQII and WoW, so to be enjoying Vanguard as much as I do and have it disappoint me on crafting is a complete let down.

Just my 2cp.

[Gutdog]

The thing is to my knowledge there has been no acknowledgement from Sigil that this is an issue they are aware of. As there has been several patches since this problem first started I can only conclude that crafting is as intended or they are ignoring the problem.

[Revolver Koala]

The thing is to my knowledge there has been no acknowledgement from Sigil that this is an issue they are aware of. As there has been several patches since this problem first started I can only conclude that crafting is as intended or they are ignoring the problem.
Yeah, I'm bothered by this too. Sometimes I get lucky and will get an A on a moderate item with almost no complications, but much, much more often I get stuff like half a dozen+ complications on an Easy WO and barely finish it with a B. I can't tell you how many times I have had an item up to A quality only to get hit with an action cost complication at the last possible turn and not be able to finish it at all. I failed two or three items like that just today. I know they've got a lot of stuff on their plate, like making Diplomacy usable, but if I don't see at least some kind of acknowledgement of the issue by Sigil I don't know if I'm going to continue as a crafter. I was really excited about it (to the point that my crafting level has almost exceeded my adventuring level now), but if it's "working as intended" as it is now, that's unacceptable. The crafting system was supposed to be a major sphere of the game, but it kind of feels tacked-on and boring right now... I'm not quitting Vanguard over it, but it'd cause me to jump ship for another MMO that had an attractive crafting system.

[Riggin]

The thing is to my knowledge there has been no acknowledgement from Sigil that this is an issue they are aware of. As there has been several patches since this problem first started I can only conclude that crafting is as intended or they are ignoring the problem.

There was an in-game world notice that said they were aware of the issue and that there was no need to send any further /petition or /bug reports. Happened Sunday the 4th if I recall correctly(could be wrong though).

I still waiting too, however. A couple of patches since then and it's still a pain in the posterior. It doesn't seem like it'd be difficult to change the algorithm for complications, but what do I know? It could be a massive undertaking on a complex system. Hopefully it's worked out soon since I'm playing this game primarily through the crafting sphere.

-Riggin

[Gutdog]

Let me just say that I like Vanguard. I think it shows alot of potential and I would really like to see it succeed.

Now with regards to the ridiculous amount of complications, the situation now really begs the perfectly reasonable question:

How much longer do we have to put up with this ****ing sh*t?

There now I am calm again and I can head back into game to be annoyed by the stupid situation in the crafting system again. Hopefully it will all be fixed soon but the lack of comment by Sigil is worrying.....

[Gutdog]

Bah I came straight back out of the game when it gave me a complication everytime I pressed the button on a moderate work order in stage 2. I never got beyond that stage. Also I was using skills which I have concentrated upon and maxed out for that level only to be awarded a complication EVERY time.

I do like this game (though I have to keep telling myself that when crafting). Unfortunately I just can't bring myself to recommend it to my friends now........

[Revolver Koala]

I can't find the thread anymore since they moved their forums, but there's a dev post on VGCrafters somewhere about actions not using the proper skill/stat values and apparently making crafting much harder than it should be. Hopefully we see a fix for this soon, and hopefully it indeed makes crafting tolerable, because holy crap is it bad right now. A few days ago I didn't really mind, still being low-level, but as I've gotten up to level 9 and then 10 I've noticed that it seems to get more and more frustrating each level; you get just as many complications and your actions seem to do less and less on the same relative levels of WOs, even after skilling up. It's ridiculously tedious and frustrating; I know I'm in the minority here, but the crafting system as it is right now is a gamebreaker for me. I've been pining for a game with a robust crafting system that I can play with more or less full-time ever since I quit UO for Everquest (I know SWG had one, but the game overall was so broken that the brokenness manifested physically in the form of mysterious residues inside the servers; I'm giving the free trial a shot now, 'cause I haven't played since a month or two after launch), so having been promised one for this game, the way it is now has me megas disappointed. Hopefully, though, the rough spots will be out soon; I kinda understand the focus on balancing adventuring and on making diplomacy work in something more than a provisional manner, but I want some crafting love too.

[shamusmacgowan]

A fix would be nice for this soon. It's ridiculous that we can barely get to C on a moderate workorder, and then only if we don't get hit with too many complications.

I've also noticed lately that when I get obsessive blacksmith, typically the very next complication I get is the one that saps the quality.

[Revolver Koala]

Huh... After balancing out my skills a little bit, I seem to be doing better. I don't have the time right now to go back and check people's levels (got to leave for work in a minute), but I'm halfway through 11 right now and I generally get more Bs than Cs on the low end of Moderate WOs, even without materials. I usually don't bother using them, because it generally gets me a few more Bs but barely any As, which would be worth it if it wasn't for the time it took to go out and harvest all those materials. I still think it needs to be made easier overall... Kinda frustrating just to level up if you're not interested in micromanagement. Does anyone remember that dev post I mentioned in my last post? Sounds like there's a fix in the works, though who knows when it's going live. If it hasn't already; I forget how old that post is.

[shamusmacgowan]

Huh... After balancing out my skills a little bit, I seem to be doing better. I don't have the time right now to go back and check people's levels (got to leave for work in a minute), but I'm halfway through 11 right now and I generally get more Bs than Cs on the low end of Moderate WOs, even without materials. I usually don't bother using them, because it generally gets me a few more Bs but barely any As, which would be worth it if it wasn't for the time it took to go out and harvest all those materials. I still think it needs to be made easier overall... Kinda frustrating just to level up if you're not interested in micromanagement. Does anyone remember that dev post I mentioned in my last post? Sounds like there's a fix in the works, though who knows when it's going live. If it hasn't already; I forget how old that post is.
Just trying to keep this alive until the fix does come.

[ThreadKiller]

we can fix this problem right here.....instead of calling a recipe "very easy" we'll just call that one "hard"....now for the "easy" we'll call that one "very hard", moderate will now be called "extra hard", "hard" will now just be called "impossible", and we'll call "downright next to impossible" well we'll just call that one "forget-about-it".


see real easy.....all fixed.....yeah I'm waiting for some kind of fix too. :)

[Riggin]

Anyone else notice that the "All But Impossible" WOs are at the bottom of the list, and are real easy? Or is it just me?
-Riggin

[ThreadKiller]

i was too afraid to try them.

[Riggin]

i was too afraid to try them.

I knew that the more difficult WOs tended to be up top, so on a lark I tried one. I got 6 or 7 complications on a whole batch of items. I didn't think to compare exp differences, mainly since I don't have a UI that gives me actual numbers, but I'm curious to see if they're worth more exp. If anyone would like to test this out, I'll send ya a cookie.

-Riggin

[Lydia]

I'm coming from EQ2. All I can say is be very, very careful what you wish for. If they make crafting easy, then they make crafted items junk. Like someone said, this might be intended as our death penalty. No risk = no reward.

It might be a little off now, but I think expecting to get average (C) quality on a moderate (even con) work order is reasonable, as is having difficulty getting above grade D on difficult (higher level) orders. (hence the description... ;) )

[ThreadKiller]

I come from EQ2 also, and I do appreciate difficulty.....but random difficulty due to bugs is another story. The system obviously doesn't take into acoount your skill level, or clothes buffers, or something.

[Vidrak]

I come from EQ2 also, and I do appreciate difficulty.....but random difficulty due to bugs is another story. The system obviously doesn't take into acoount your skill level, or clothes buffers, or something.
Yea, I think it has something to do with your crafting clothes not adding didly to anything. I am past the skill cap for some skills for my lvl and I still get totally dominated half the time.

I don't have any hard numbers, but it is about the same difficulty naked as it is with nice gear on. It is pretty rediculous IMO. I would look back at that one patch a couple weeks ago and see what changed. The error was definitely there.

[shamusmacgowan]

I'm coming from EQ2. All I can say is be very, very careful what you wish for. If they make crafting easy, then they make crafted items junk. Like someone said, this might be intended as our death penalty. No risk = no reward.

It might be a little off now, but I think expecting to get average (C) quality on a moderate (even con) work order is reasonable, as is having difficulty getting above grade D on difficult (higher level) orders. (hence the description... ;) )

I can understand that, but this isn't completely a case of risk vs. reward. It is quite literraly near impossible to even finish a difficult WO without working quality at all, let alone making a C with it to get experience. I'm not saying I should be able to get an A on it, but I ought to have a good chance of a C.

[Revolver Koala]

Quick note I wanted to drop in here, since this seems to be as good a place as any: I noticed that when I get an AP penalty complication, the results I get on my tasks seem to decrease significantly; similarly, the Chipped Material complication that I get on Artisan WOs, which states that it carries a Moderate quality penalty, also gives you a Low AP cost penalty. Both of these seem like bugs to me; the AP penalty/effectiveness penalty problem is actually worse, because they appear so often. It kind of removes most of the advantage of crafting through an AP complication if it slows you down, too.

[jgoerl]

Is it just me or does it seem that crafting gets worse and worse every time they restart the servers? I spent alot on crafting clothes and they have no effect. I get the same results with them or without them now. Recipies that I could take to B level, I can not even complete at D. What is going on here? I have not changed anything on my end. I, litterally, failed a very easy recipie that I took to barely C. I had a moderate complication that took me 6 turns to clear a 5 turn complication. I will not be paying to get subjected to this. Yeah, I know they are tweaking things but when I can not complete a very easy with some expensive + crafting clothes... Not for me. Not to mention that we get zero feedback and a hint that it is working as intended. This level 14 Outfitter just quit.