[PerritoBites]

http://www.ibuypower.com/mall/lobby.htm

I have never heard of the site. It sells pre-built computers at a great price. So is there a catch I am not seeing? Earlier today I was reading on liquid cooling system and how it would be very expensive to have it on the comp... but this site has computers with liquid cooling at under 1k! To me it seems like it is even cheaper than if I built it myself! (or maybe the same price) Has anyone used the site or heard about it?

[rhagz]

It's been around for a while. I've never bought there but I hear people saying they have. Seems like it should be at least semi-reputable to stay in business and have no glaring bad press.

[rabb1t]

So is there a catch I am not seeing?

Well, for one thing, they are using the X2 4000+ core. That is what I'd consider entry-level for a gaming rig today. That core is only worth around $80 and really fairly weak compared to the Core 2 Duo line, even the cheaper ones.

Just because it is liquid based doesn't mean it is a good deal for the money. Let's do some comparisons to my $1500 build (the "Jackalope"). I'll only compare where things are pretty different.

Them: X2 4000+, value = $ 79
Me: Core 2 Duo E6320, value = $ 165
Difference: Tom's says ~21% gain on CPU power / ~5.75% gain on GPU FPS

Them: MSI K9N4 SLI-F nForce 500 Northbridge, value = $ 55
Me: Asus P5N-E SLI nForce 650i, value = $ 140
Difference: Mine is a newer chipset, though AMD is still on series 5, but mine also has passive cooling (no annoyingly loud fan that is prone to failure)

Them: GPU brand not stated

While this probably isn't a huge deal, the coverage policies on the manufacturers can vary greatly. However, their policy may be what matters in terms of replacing a GPU. You'd need to read up on what is covered under what conditions. Also note that with many system builders your policy is negated if you change out parts. So, you maybe 'stuck' with having only the GPU that comes with the system covered for the full period. (So, if the period is 3 years and you replace it in 1.5 years that new GPU probably won't be covered under their policy and you'd have to keep the old one just in case you needed to pretend it was still being used if something in the system failed, if swapping the GPU causes your policy to become negated, which could complicate things.)

Them: 500 gig drive
Me: 250 gig drive
Difference: meh, they appear to have a slightly better deal there

Them: on-motherboard sound
Me: X-Fi XtremeGamer
Difference: could be huge

Them: Viewsonic 20" 1680x1050
Me: Acer 22" 1680x1050
Difference: meh, 2"

Them: Logitech Optical Internet Mouse, value = $ 4
Me: Logitech G5, value = $45
Difference: huge if you like fine tuning controls

Them: zip
Me: APC Surge arrest
Difference: well, could be nothing, could be the item that saves your system from exploding when you get a power surge

So... yeah, it does appear their high-end build is a 'fair deal'. Checking around the web real quick the value on that liquid cooler appears to be around $80-100. Be aware you are also 'loosing control' by not doing the build yourself. By this I mean that some part choices will be completely out of your hands. Note the "Corsair-Value or Major Brand" in the ram, and "Major Brand Powered by Nvidia" in the GPU manufacturer. (Though this one appears to have a counter by clicking a selection of Evga for only $5 more.)

So, not counting the differences in individual parts above, you ask the right question - What are we not seeing / What is the catch? With that cooler being worth $80-100, even if we drop that down to around $75 for their price, we have to wonder why it seems like such a fair deal. Looking at the parts differences, we are looking at about around +100 more in value from my system; this includes the offset for the liquid. So, they don't appear to be making a whole lot of $ off that $1500 build unless they get a big reduction by being a retailer. If we assume a 10% reduction for them being a reseller, then we arrive at about $250-300 of that build going to markup. (Which is +20%, which is in the 'fair' range for system builders.)

Honestly though, considering that liquid system is tiny, and only covers the CPU, and really doesn't have a reservoir, I don't think it would be better than an air-cooler. Actually, let's peep some reviews. Checking a few reviews they do reference it is a bit better than the retail cooling, but also a bit noisier at higher fan speeds. (FYI the model appears to be an "AQUAGATE Mini R80 / R120")

I don't know, peeping a few other builds it seems they are only taking out about 15-20% for their build cost, which isn't too bad. If you don't know how to build a system on your own, and/or want the coverage policy, it seems a fair deal.

Me, I’d prefer to have that ~$150-250 (out of $1500) invested in the parts, along with having control to pick and choose which manufacturer parts I choose by doing the build myself (or just keep the difference and get a cheaper build), but, meh, I know how to troubleshoot stuff on my own.

[Fozzik]

Ibuypower isn't a well-kept secret or anything... You can check our Vendor Recommendation sticky and find them, as well as many other sites. I don't think the opinions of Ibuypower have been favorable, but I could be confusing them with someone else.

[PerritoBites]

Thanks rabb1t, that info is really helpful. I am trying to help a friend build his own computer, but then he sent me that link and I didn't know what to tell him hehe. After what you have said, this seems like a very good option for someone who doesn't know how to build his own. He was considering on buying a Dell, but thankfully It seems like I made him change his mind.

To tell you the truth, I wasn't expecting such a long reply! So I thank you again for this. Now, it would be nice to get the opinion of someone who used their website for an opinion on their service and shipping.

[Suds]

Well I don't know about IBuyPower, but if you are looking to go through a system builder, I'd recommend AvaDirect. I ordered my computer from AvaDirect back in February, and they were great. If you check out this thread, you can read reviews about them and other system builders. AvaDirect seems to get better reviews than IBuyPower, so you may want to check out what they have to offer before making a decision.

[Phenom]

I bought my system though Ibuypower.

Asus Striker Extreme nForce® 680i SLI Chipset w/7.1 Sound
Intel Core 2 Duo Processor E6600 (2x 2.4GHz/4MB L2 Cache/1066FSB
Corsair XMS2 Xtreme w/Heat Spreader 2048MB DDR2-800 PC6400
NVIDIA GeForce 8800GTX 768MB
2X WD 500 GB HD SATA II 7200 RPM 16M Cache
850 Watt -- Thermaltake Toughpower Power Supply

And I love it. No problems what so ever once I received it. The "Catch" IMO would be that you are at their mercy as far as how long it takes them to process and send your order. I stayed on them calling them several times etc and since they did not get my system out on time they paid for 2 day shipping which rocked.

I am sure you know this just by looking at the site, but you can click on any of the AMD or Intel pre built systems and customize / UPGRADE each individual component to something better if you choose.

The prices are Very competitive. I spent $2524 and everything from newegg would have cost around $2400 shipped, then I would have had to build it all etc. So for $100 extra bucks I got it built tested and shipped, well worth it to me.

I would, and have reccomended them to friends as long as you have the time to wait for the product. GL

[rabb1t]

Originally Posted by Phenom

The "Catch" IMO would be that you are at their mercy as far as how long it takes them to process and send your order.

Again, you are also at the mercy of the "forced parts choice". You really have no control over things like "major brand". You have no idea what they are sticking in there.

Hopefully they aren't lying, and they won't use a "major brand"s cheap part, but still, if you want control over the manufacturer and parts at all levels of the build, most often you can only get that by building yourself.

But, as you mention, you have to have the knowledge of both the parts and how to build, in order to do that.

[Suds]

Originally Posted by rabb1t

Again, you are also at the mercy of the "forced parts choice". You really have no control over things like "major brand". You have no idea what they are sticking in there.

That's another reason I recommend AvaDirect. Their selection includes almost every major brand out there for the GPU, RAM, or what have you. They have a great selection of parts.

[Phenom]

Originally Posted by rabb1t

Again, you are also at the mercy of the "forced parts choice". You really have no control over things like "major brand". You have no idea what they are sticking in there.

Hopefully they aren't lying, and they won't use a "major brand"s cheap part, but still, if you want control over the manufacturer and parts at all levels of the build, most often you can only get that by building yourself.

But, as you mention, you have to have the knowledge of both the parts and how to build, in order to do that.

Anyone can build a computer. Not everyone has the time or wants to deal with the hassle.

Im not defending Ibuypower, I had a good experience others may have not.

They had exactly what I wanted and exactly the brands and models I would have bought anyway so it was win win for me.

Anyone who has been to there site and bothered to click on the "More Info" Button on any of there pre-built systems can see they have plenty of Major brands to choose from in all the places that matter. They give Model numbers so its not hard to do some research to see what your getting, UNLESS you choose to go cheep/generic, then you get what brand they give you obviously.

Its still a handy tool even if you don’t buy from one of them kind of companies you can just go there build the system you want using there stuff, get an idea of what it will all cost you, then print it out and see if you can find better or cheaper brands to fill the spots.

Just some examples :

Them: MSI K9N4 SLI-F nForce 500 Northbridge, value = $ 55
Me: Asus P5N-E SLI nForce 650i, value = $ 140

They offer the Asus P5N-E SLI nForce 650i so not sure what you mean.

Them: 500 gig drive
Me: 250 gig drive
Difference: meh, they appear to have a slightly better deal there

You can get 80, 160, 200, 250, 320, 400, etc .. even 150gb raptors.

Them: on-motherboard sound
Me: X-Fi XtremeGamer
Difference: could be huge

You can choose the X-Fi XtremeGamer if you want or you can choose none and buy it on sale elswere same with the mouse even though they do offer the G5 too .. Monitor same same don’t buy theres buy from someplace else if you want.. /shrug.

[rabb1t]

Originally Posted by Phenom

Anyone can build a computer. Not everyone has the time or wants to deal with the hassle.

True enough.

They offer the Asus P5N-E SLI nForce 650i so not sure what you mean.

I was comparing their build at $1500 to my build at $1500 and pointing out differences.

If you wanted to / could match part-to-part you could do it that way too. I was just pointing out 'what you get' for the builds and how you may, or may not be, getting 'a good deal' for the price, as the OP was asking/wondering about.

I'm not saying it's not a good deal. I'm just saying be aware that some manufacturer's don't allow a good selection of parts, and that all will take monies for doing the build, and that fee/increase in price will vary between builder to builder.

“Is it a good deal or not” will be based on what the person wants, how much they are willing to spend, what the system builder’s markup is, etc., etc.

[Phenom]

Originally Posted by rabb1t

True enough.



I was comparing their build at $1500 to my build at $1500 and pointing out differences.

If you wanted to / could match part-to-part you could do it that way too. I was just pointing out 'what you get' for the builds and how you may, or may not be, getting 'a good deal' for the price, as the OP was asking/wondering about.

I'm not saying it's not a good deal. I'm just saying be aware that some manufacturer's don't allow a good selection of parts, and that all will take monies for doing the build, and that fee/increase in price will vary between builder to builder.

“Is it a good deal or not” will be based on what the person wants, how much they are willing to spend, what the system builder’s markup is, etc., etc.

Have you treid to build a $1500 system on there ? I personaly have not but It would be cool to see what you can come up with since shipping would have to be factored in.. Ill give this a try at lunch sounds kinda fun.

[rabb1t]

Originally Posted by Phenom

but It would be cool to see what you can come up with since shipping would have to be factored in.

It isn't shipping you should worry about, but whatever markup they are adding for the build and their warrantee coverage.

And no, I don't go building systems at system manufacturer's sites unless a peep has specifically requested someone do that to help them out.

[dakyres]

Ibuypower as a system builder has a very low rating for customer satisfaction , and awful tech support. That in itself would lead me away from them.

[Phenom]

Originally Posted by rabb1t

It isn't shipping you should worry about, but whatever markup they are adding for the build and their warrantee coverage.

750 Watt -- Thermaltake Toughpower
Asus P5N-E SLI nForce® 650i SLI Chipset
2GB Corsair XMS2 Xtreme w/Heat Spreader
8800 GTS 320MB
250 GB HARD DRIVE
18X Dual Format/Double Layer DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Drive
16x DVD-ROM Drive
Intel Core 2 Duo Processor E6600 (2x 2.4GHz/4MB L2 Cache/1066FSB)
Vista 32 or Win XP pro - You actually save $31 if you go with vista for this I went with XP since everyone is so scared of vista even though I run VG on it with NP's

$1507 w/shipping 3 year warranty and life time tech support $$1592

Same stuff at tigerdirect was $1548 shipped ..thats with xp pro oem

EDIT : same stuff at newegg is $1508 shipped... but there is like $65 worth of rebates to get also