[Socratic]

If you want to make particles a necessary part of an encounter can you at least fix the settings options so they actually turn the right particles on/off? It's the same issue with the dust/powder groundspawns in Rahz Inkur.

My Environmental Particles is ALWAYS at 100% but I can only see the Rahz ground spawns if I do a full exit and restart (coming back with default particle settings, all being on).

Honestly everyone is better off if you figure out a way to make the particles override options if they are necessary for an event. Or simply find another way to signify whatever it is that is necessary other than particle effects.

If I have to turn on particles to see vital elements of a raid encounter I'm going to lag so hard you might as well just give the mob an AE that floods bandwidth.

If you want to use particles for this crap then actually fix it so a player can isolate necessary ones from the "pretty" crap that just causes lag.

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Mardy

Are you guys looking into possibility of making it so this npc can't be perma farmed by someone that simply times the respawn? I guess since he respawns every 4 hours, he can be perma farmed. The amount of endgame content is so limited, you have so many guilds fighting over this spawn, and many people simply logoff upset.

It would be one thing if there are lots of endgame content choices, so if people find this npc taken or down, they could go elsewhere to do something else. But right now there are too many guilds farming this mob just for loot. Before people start crying for instances, could you find a way to make this mob available to more players please? One way you could do this is by putting flags on people's characters so they can only kill him once every 2 days or something.

Thanks.

Tsuda already said he fixed the AFK camping of Heg.

A group of 3-4 people logging off in the room, and logging on 5 min before each spawn is not good.

Additionally, if they went down there, after another group that had opened the stairs, they wouldn't even have to know how to complete the encounter.

What is not a problem, and is working as intended, is an organized Guild can, once they have the unlocking of the encounter perfected, strategically plan their play time around the spawn of the encounter (since the entire set of 4+ NM's are reset every spawn), and are able to get each kill, either because other guilds are less organized, or because they have not figured out the encounter.

This is the realities of an uninstanced game, and what we all signed on for, when choosing to play Vaguard.

BTW, is there plans to isolate the number of people who get past the Raea force field, because, as it stands now, other groups can just rush the stairs after they fall, and snag
Heg, while a group that executes the actual unlocking of the stairs, who has loot to deal with on the Timeweaver (which can be heroic/soulbound) could easily be kill stolen.

[Mardy]

But wait, that's what you signed up for!

j/k, like I said, if there were a lot of other endgame choices, I wouldn't complain. But since there are not, they should make this mob available to as many people as possible. It's not as if lvl 50's aren't bored enough already. Make them logoff pissed off due to some guild having the npc timed sucks with the current state of the content.

[Aixem]

Its getting even worse......

We anted to do Hegenrian but there was also another group, we tried to managed the situation to get the next 4 hour kill.
So we got an arangement .....

After 4 hours the guild was down there again, but gave us some time to kill the first mops. (Later we checked why)

But then in the hourglas room, while we tried to break the glas....


The Leader of the other group just logged off and on on the stairs and could easy walk down the stairs without breaking the glas.

He pulled Hegnerian with closed stairs up the hourglas room and killed him with his group infront of our eyes....

Its even now impossible to get him on our low populated server, must be kickAss after the server merge.

Got some nice screenshots of kill a arangement breaking, killstealing and exploiting guild but what to do

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Aixem

Its getting even worse......

We anted to do Hegenrian but there was also another group, we tried to managed the situation to get the next 4 hour kill.
So we got an arangement .....

After 4 hours the guild was down there again, but gave us some time to kill the first mops. (Later we checked why)

But then in the hourglas room, while we tried to break the glas....


The Leader of the other group just logged off and on on the stairs and could easy walk down the stairs without breaking the glas.

He pulled Hegnerian with closed stairs up the hourglas room and killed him with his group infront of our eyes....

Its even now impossible to get him on our low populated server, must be kickAss after the server merge.

Got some nice screenshots of kill a arangement breaking, killstealing and exploiting guild but what to do

Wow, that isn't cool at all.

The guild I am in, patiently waited on Saturday for another guild to make their attempt at Hegnerian for a number of hours, because we came late to the spawn, and they had already killed Raea.

After a number of hours, they left, and we were able to kill the Hegnerian who had been just sitting there, waiting for someone to kill him.

Deffinately seems as though the situations on various servers are drastically different, and I can appreciate our situation a little bit more.

It does sound like the Dev for this content has enabled some fixes, for what he sees as porblem areas, but it deffinately seems like a good idea to outline the various methods groups are using on Hegnarian atm, so he covers all posibilities. Figuratively speaking, closing 3 doors, while leaving a fourth whide open, just diverts the crouds to that route, rather then actually preventing them from getting through.

[Vordox]

While I have no problems at all with Purplenv and his guild (they all seems to be nice people) I came to the area the prior week and nicely asked the Guild leader Pontifax to shoot me a tell when they were done to give us a chance to get in there and figure things out. Never recieved a response so just kept checking the area /who to see if they were there when I had people on to try the encounter.

Saturday morning was that day we got in killed the first guardian they then showed up shortly after which was no problem to me, but when you got a group of differing personalities some get flustered being watched. So no they certainly didn't prevent us from trying but there was still frustration added by being watched and not knowing what may happen. I was present at one of their attempts at Hegnerion and talked to the guild leader and gave him the courtesy by recalling out to allow them to go about their kill unhindered. It's just good courtesy.

I just wanted the chance of figuring out the encounter (without the added emotes) just because I hadn't done this one. I have been in the area over 2 weeks and have left these same guys to it. Don't get me wrong they certainly
have the right to farm what they want but courtesy goes a long way sometimes.

I must agree though after the merge it will in fact be a grieffest over what little content there is anyway. I would rather quit playing at all then fight over a few spawns just to old for that crap I guess or much wiser maybe.

Disclaimer:Watchtower is a great guild of people who work well together and I harbor no Ill will toward them and wish them much success.

[Ellestil]

The problem isn't instanced vs non-instanced content or what people signed on for, the problem is giving a quest mob a huge loot table that puts him on farm status for items other than the one quest item everyone else needs.

That is the error. If this guy was just a regular challenging named mob not attached to any quests, it would be first come first serve, as to be expected. However, since his loot table is so nice, people don't just come in to get their core then leave. They stay for days, weeks even, farming the guy and no one else gets to finish their quest.

Either remove the loot table and give it to another mob, or remove the core from this guy and put it on something else that's for the quest only. Problem solved.

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Ellestil

The problem isn't instanced vs non-instanced content or what people signed on for, the problem is giving a quest mob a huge loot table that puts him on farm status for items other than the one quest item everyone else needs.

That is the error. If this guy was just a regular challenging named mob not attached to any quests, it would be first come first serve, as to be expected. However, since his loot table is so nice, people don't just come in to get their core then leave. They stay for days, weeks even, farming the guy and no one else gets to finish their quest.

Either remove the loot table and give it to another mob, or remove the core from this guy and put it on something else that's for the quest only. Problem solved.

What's the quest for that is attached to Heg? (Well there is two).

1 - The core needed to get a faction BP. What else is required for this BP? A pattern drop which is of unknow difficulty to obtain, because it is still broke, and basically VT drop off an opposing faction.
A 50% drop from Heg + targeting a specific drop from a 6dot in the various factions = a pretty cool lvl 50 heroic BP with a clicky.
You get to pick the BP, and you are not stuck relying on a random loot table from heg, just the 50% on the core.

2 - The cloak. We assume one kill will update upto the 6 people in the groups quest, and everyone can have a heroic cloak.


So, the quests that you speak of. These are not quests for a massive storyline that continues far past the Hegnerian encounter, and is critical for the enjoyment of the game. The quests you are so desperate to complete, that are SOOO much more important than other people farming for gear, are only for GEAR.

So to sumarize, your saying.

"Dev's please take the gear off this mob, so I can get MY GEAR"

The entire encounter is about loot.
There are 4 NM's, all having the chance to drop heroic loot, but also with massive loot tables, which often also drop yellows.
The yellows, however nice, are easily not of much use, if you have completed the swamp gear, and upgraded them. (along with other sources of good gear, including crafted.) Almost every yellow we get now, goes straight to decon.

I agree 100% with anyone that says the encounter is broken. It is.
There is no way someone solo should be able to walk right up to Hegnerian, which is totally possible now.
There is no way groups should be able to AFK camp, or Tombstone camp heg, which they do now.

What I do NOT agree with, is that your loot is more important then my loot, and things need to change so you can get, your loot.

We'll see how Tsudanosh fixes this.
I hope its done right.
I hope its getting hammered in QA on their end, because just simple things like the stairs default loading to open, then closing, vs default loading to closed, then opening, if the criteria was met, as well as not allowing line of sight past the stairs are things that can go a long way to give some relief from the griefing.

Shit, if the encounter works right, you can't get down there without atleast 3 people, and 3 people is all you need.

BTW, Thanks for the respect Vordox. We appreciate the situation that you are in, while we are also after the same thing. The problem with the encounter as it is currently, is you can't "try to figure it out" unless Hegnerian is up. Unless the group afk camps in Heg's room, there is no way to leave the encounter you were on active. Which would be why it would be hard for us to invite you to try it, while knowing Heg is down there, unkilled.

[Ellestil]

What I'm saying is, anytime a quest oriented mob is paired with a massively great loot table that has nothing to do with said quest, that mob will be put on farm status for its loot table and not the quest item. Therefore, anyone wanting to try and get to the mob only for quest purposes cannot because he is being farmed non-stop.

Farming a non-quest NPC with an awesome loot table, go for it, camp it for all I care. Farming a quest npc so that people cannot advance or finish what they started, not a good design. Making it exploitable, even worse design. There's no reason the guardian's couldn't just have a chance to drop the core instead. Heg can remain his nice normal self dropping great items for those who care to challenge him. But at least that way people's attempt to finish their quest for their swamp armor won't be totally hindered by mob farmers.

What if the NPC you turned the items in to for the rewards were camped 24/7 for weeks because it had a nice loot table? People would cry foul then wouldn't they. This is no different. Quest mob on farm status, whether the giver of the quest, an item giver for the quest, or the finisher for the quest is bad design if it's being farmed for something that has nothing to do with the quest itself.

You think it's bad now just wait till the servers merge. It will be a nightmare.

[Arglaar]

Originally Posted by Purplenv

BTW, Thanks for the respect Vordox. We appreciate the situation that you are in, while we are also after the same thing. The problem with the encounter as it is currently, is you can't "try to figure it out" unless Hegnerian is up. Unless the group afk camps in Heg's room, there is no way to leave the encounter you were on active. Which would be why it would be hard for us to invite you to try it, while knowing Heg is down there, unkilled.

In other words, we've already figured out how to do it, and we don't want to risk letting someone else get OUR LOOT so, unless you know also, we don't have time to wait for you to figure it out so move aside and let us "play through".

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Arglaar

In other words, we've already figured out how to do it, and we don't want to risk letting someone else get OUR LOOT so, unless you know also, we don't have time to wait for you to figure it out so move aside and let us "play through".

To bad you don't know what your talking about.
We did not play through.
We let them have at it for over 2 hours, closer to 3, without griefing. (Other then our pressence, and in hind sight, I can see how that may have added some pressure, but we did NOT hinder their progress at all) Also with the agreement that we would not take Hegnerian if they legitimately got past the stairs. (How far they believed that, I am unsure, but it was our intention regardless)
In the end they left, and we continued on to Hegnerian.

[Bladefyre]

This is the one thing I don't miss about contested mobs with nice loot, which isn't instanced.

[Arglaar]

Originally Posted by Purplenv

To bad you don't know what your talking about.
We did not play through.
We let them have at it for over 2 hours, closer to 3, without griefing. (Other then our pressence, and in hind sight, I can see how that may have added some pressure, but we did NOT hinder their progress at all) Also with the agreement that we would not take Hegnerian if they legitimately got past the stairs. (How far they believed that, I am unsure, but it was our intention regardless)
In the end they left, and we continued on to Hegnerian.

Then how do you explain this quote?

Which would be why it would be hard for us to invite you to try it, while knowing Heg is down there, unkilled.

You let them try it... You knew Heg was there waiting for "Someone" to kill him. The longer it took them to do the encounter, the longer you had to sit there and the longer Heg sat "waiting to be killed".

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Arglaar

In other words, we've already figured out how to do it, and we don't want to risk letting someone else get OUR LOOT so, unless you know also, we don't have time to wait for you to figure it out so move aside and let us "play through".

Originally Posted by Arglaar

Then how do you explain this quote?


You let them try it... You knew Heg was there waiting for "Someone" to kill him. The longer it took them to do the encounter, the longer you had to sit there and the longer Heg sat "waiting to be killed".

Heh, we didn't invite them to try it.
We got lazy, and got there after the event had spawned, and they had already killed Raea, as Vordox pointed out.

and yes, we stood there, in the hourglass room, doing nothing, for over 50% of a Hegnerian respawn time.

[Vassago]

whats happening on are server is , we do all the guardians get down to him and he is never up /sigh

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Vassago

whats happening on are server is , we do all the guardians get down to him and he is never up /sigh

Yah, we had that happen to us for the first time yesterday afternoon.

All the complaining about the methods to exploit have made it fairly common knowledge now.

[Purplenv]

Pretty quiet on this subject today considering what transpired last night for us.

Did any other servers have elevated GM pressence in regards to this encounter?

We had practically instant GM response last night, complete with GM warping, and chunk restarts and everything.

Thank you Ichie for the prompt service.

[rordell]

Originally Posted by Purplenv

Pretty quiet on this subject today considering what transpired last night for us.

Did any other servers have elevated GM pressence in regards to this encounter?

We had practically instant GM response last night, complete with GM warping, and chunk restarts and everything.

Thank you Ichie for the prompt service.

I feel your pain Purplenv. I have been following this mess and avoiding taking our ED groups down there until all this crap dies down, screw the drama, theres enough to work on in Rhaz in the meantime.

[Cas]

As of this morning Hegnerian is leashed to his room and can't be pulled to the hourglass room anymore, which is a good thing.

[Purplenv]

Originally Posted by Cas

As of this morning Hegnerian is leashed to his room and can't be pulled to the hourglass room anymore, which is a good thing.

SWEET.