[Cas]

Originally Posted by rhagz

Did you even read the official announcement?
It doesn't get any clearer than that. 12 people.

Yes, thanks I read it. It's still not final, trust me. Whether they will succeed or not, we don't know, but they are trying hard to make the zone work for 24 people, even after that announcement. I was just talking about it with a developer last night.

[KombatJesus]

Originally Posted by Cas

Yes, thanks I read it. It's still not final, trust me. Whether they will succeed or not, we don't know, but they are trying hard to make the zone work for 24 people, even after that announcement. I was just talking about it with a developer last night.

See what they will do with performance before saying anything more about what they are going to do with raids. If the performance isn't there then the raids wont be there. We have heard too much of what they are going to do, lets just sit back tell them to shut up with all of the extraneous crap about their plans and fix perf and add the polish OR tell us that they cannot fix the performance.

[Nikantor]

Originally Posted by Cas

Yes, thanks I read it. It's still not final, trust me. Whether they will succeed or not, we don't know, but they are trying hard to make the zone work for 24 people, even after that announcement. I was just talking about it with a developer last night.

Horsecrap...

You are trolling and making crap up end of story. They arent putting 24 man content into APW. Any 24 man stuff they might be working on is later down the line think stirhaad or Garuzamet... NOT APW.

I dont think i even need to cite why I know and why I know you are full of it.

[Cas]

Originally Posted by Nikantor

Horsecrap...

You are trolling and making crap up end of story. They arent putting 24 man content into APW. Any 24 man stuff they might be working on is later down the line think stirhaad or Garuzamet... NOT APW.

I dont think i even need to cite why I know and why I know you are full of it.

Ok, genius.

I am glad you got it all figured out. Anyway, when a content designer working on the zone on thursday night tells me they are still trying to make it work for 24, there's no reason for me not to believe him. He didn't say it will be happening, he said they are trying.

Next time you log on to test APW, ask again whether it's final, instead of accusing me of making up "crap", when there's no reason for me to be doing so.

[Cobalty2004]

Originally Posted by Cas

Ok, genius.

I am glad you got it all figured out. Anyway, when a content designer working on the zone on thursday night tells me they are still trying to make it work for 24, there's no reason for me not to believe him. He didn't say it will be happening, he said they are trying.

Next time you log on to test APW, ask again whether it's final, instead of accusing me of making up "crap", when there's no reason for me to be doing so.

And didn't the devs say something about flying mount quests at launch... raids by May, player made cities?

[Cas]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

And didn't the devs say something about flying mount quests at launch... raids by May, player made cities?

And I bet they didn't want to make them, because they hate the players. We got it, they haven't delivered what they have "promised" yet, but they are definitely trying to do their best to get this stuff in as soon as possible.

For some that isn't enough and they left either for good or to come back when it has been delivered and that's their right.

[rhagz]

Originally Posted by Cas

And I bet they didn't want to make them, because they hate the players. We got it, they haven't delivered what they have "promised" yet, but they are definitely trying to do their best to get this stuff in as soon as possible.

For some that isn't enough and they left either for good or to come back when it has been delivered and that's their right.

If 6 months to get flying mounts that were advertised as in game actually in the game is their 'best', then please don't let them have a bad stretch.

[Cobalty2004]

Originally Posted by Cas

And I bet they didn't want to make them, because they hate the players. We got it, they haven't delivered what they have "promised" yet, but they are definitely trying to do their best to get this stuff in as soon as possible.

For some that isn't enough and they left either for good or to come back when it has been delivered and that's their right.

/yawn

So Cas, when will your class fit the "vision" and won't be able to solo 6dots?

[Cas]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

/yawn

So Cas, when will your class fit the "vision" and won't be able to solo 6dots?

Interesting change of subject there.

[Venge]

Excellent...Cas is becoming just as hated as me...jp!

[Karnos]

Originally Posted by Venge

Excellent...Cas is becoming just as hated as me...jp!

I doubt anyone hates you, Venge. Few people are as reasonable and constructive in trying to improve their class as you.

[Karnos]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

And didn't the devs say something about flying mount quests at launch... raids by May, player made cities?

I don't get what the negative attitude is all about. Do you seriously believe that the designers and developers aren't doing everything they can?

From a business standpoint--and SOE and Sigil are certainly both businesses before anything else--it would be sheer idiocy to deliberately hold back on delivering content, functionality, or what have you.

Every month, people are leaving because they aren't getting what they were hoping for in the game, and lost subscriptions are bad for business. Ergo, SOE is doing their best to deliver what people want, as soon as they can do so without causing more problems for themselves (i.e., they don't want to introduce more bugs on the live servers).

Should you be disappointed? Perhaps, but you sound to me as though you are angry at someone, which is what I fail to understand. SOE, and Sigil before them, have been trying their darndest to create the promised game, and while there are a lot of things yet to be done, Vanguard still seems the best MMORPG since EQ1, so they got a lot right already.

If you prefer the polished, casual-friendly Age of Conan, then I am happy for you. The world--if it stays true to the source material--is certainly going to be the coolest ever.

Personally, however, I am going to stick with Vanguard as the game comes fully into its own over the course of the next year.

[Cobalty2004]

Originally Posted by Karnos

I don't get what the negative attitude is all about. Do you seriously believe that the designers and developers aren't doing everything they can?

From a business standpoint--and SOE and Sigil are certainly both businesses before anything else--it would be sheer idiocy to deliberately hold back on delivering content, functionality, or what have you.

Every month, people are leaving because they aren't getting what they were hoping for in the game, and lost subscriptions are bad for business. Ergo, SOE is doing their best to deliver what people want, as soon as they can do so without causing more problems for themselves (i.e., they don't want to introduce more bugs on the live servers).

Should you be disappointed? Perhaps, but you sound to me as though you are angry at someone, which is what I fail to understand. SOE, and Sigil before them, have been trying their darndest to create the promised game, and while there are a lot of things yet to be done, Vanguard still seems the best MMORPG since EQ1, so they got a lot right already.

If you prefer the polished, casual-friendly Age of Conan, then I am happy for you. The world--if it stays true to the source material--is certainly going to be the coolest ever.

Personally, however, I am going to stick with Vanguard as the game comes fully into its own over the course of the next year.

Vanguard doesn't offer anything new to the MMO scheme now that we know what the true Vanguard is.

AoC at least offers skill-based combat, nudity, fatality moves, and other never before done in an MMO before.

Oh and mounted combat ftw!

[sjb1]

Originally Posted by Cas

Anyway, when a content designer working on the zone on thursday night tells me they are still trying to make it work for 24

I must be missing something here. Why should I believe this comment is true? who are you? why do you have special info from developers, that contridict the official announcments?

granted the official announcment could be called horseshit. what's this crap about "The Ancient Port Warehouse has always been intended for 12 man raiding parties", since when?

Anyway not saying they aren't trying to get 24 man raids in, since they must be well aware 12 man is lame. However if they have been testing and balancing for 12 people, then changing to 24 is just going to delay it even more.

[Karnos]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

Vanguard doesn't offer anything new to the MMO scheme now that we know what the true Vanguard is.

Not anything new?

You have what I would consider the most interesting, diverse set of classes since EverQuest 1, including a couple that are completely unique. Yeah, some classes, notably warriors, rogues, and shamans, still need a lot of work, but those few exceptions aside, Vanguard is leagues ahead of games such as WoW and EverQuest 2, both in terms of ingenuity as well as class balance.

There are brotherhoods/fellowships, which are going live with the next Game Update.

You have the best trade skill system ever implemented in any game.

You have diplomacy, an entirely original concept which a lot of people find exciting.

If you ignore the ridiculously overpowered fears and roots which allow people to solo 5- and sometimes even 6-dots--something which is undoubtedly going to be fixed within the next few months--then Vanguard remains the most challenging PvE MMORPG since EverQuest 1, which I am sure we can agree is a very good thing indeed.

The Vanguard combat system is currently better balanced than any game of its kind. Yeah, it is no secret that I would like to see the game become as hard as the GoD expansion back in EQ1, but the fact remains that, even as things stand, games like WoW and EQ2 are much, much easier, where everything is about DPS while gear quality and theoretical survivability advantages have been rendered practically irrelevant.

Vanguard has arguably the best graphics and sounds ever seen in a game of its type.

The Vanguard world is truly vast in scope. I doubt any other game could match it, except perhaps EVE, but the two are really not comparable.

Ships and buildings/homes. I am not particularly into either myself, but I know a lot of people like that kind of thing, and no game except EverQuest 2 has implemented either better than Vanguard. EverQuest 2 probably still holds the crown in terms of homes, but that is simply due to the sheer diversity of items already available in that far more established game. Most of the people I have spoken to consider the VG system of houses that are actually present in the shared game world to be inherently superior to the instance-based EQ2 version.

AoC at least offers skill-based combat

I would rather say it attempts to combine the twitch skills of an first person shooter with traditional MMO gameplay.

Is this a good thing? As someone who likes to raid and thus leans towards item-centric games, I don't think so.

Besides, I enjoy when my choices have a strong impact on the fights I engage in, but not to the point where my own twitch skills and connection speed and ping time could determine success or failure.

Timing an AE, knowing when to use which abilities/items for maximum effectiveness, and being able to react to the occasional damage spike with an oh-shit ability--all of it great. However, having to hit buttons A, C, A, and D within the next two seconds, timing two of the key strokes with the animations of the mob in front of me, isn't really my idea of fun in an MMORPG. That is what the various X-Box and PlayStation games are for.

nudity

I fail to see why on earth that would be a factor in what makes a great MMORPG. When I want nudity, I have my beautiful wife. If I didn't have my spouse or a girlfriend, I would have innumerable porn sites/movies as well as my unfettered imagination.

Seriously.

fatality moves

Again, is this Mortal Kombat or an MMORPG? The novelty of chopping off someone's head or impaling them on your pike is going to wear off rather soon, I'm sure, if the game isn't strong in terms of challenge and gameplay.

and other never before done in an MMO before.

Age of Conan has the incredible world of R. E. Howard as a setting and doesn't try to balance the various tank classes in accordance with an archetype system. Those are unquestionable selling points. They are the only ones I see, unfortunately.

Then there are the downsides:

o A game which has officially been declared casual-friendly like WoW, EverQuest 2, and Lord of the Rings Online (if you doubt me, just read the press releases). I, for one, have had quite enough of casual-friendly games.

o The graphics of AoC look sub-par, at least judging from the screenshots and videos on the official web page of the game. Certainly nothing that could touch Vanguard there.

o The twitch-based gameplay.

o Less than inspiring tank classes. A raid main tank with pike specialization? A tank running around with a banner in a dungeon?

Oh and mounted combat ftw!

Being able to sit on a horse, as opposed to standing on your feet, while swinging your sword is really important to you?

[Cobalty2004]

Originally Posted by Karnos

Then there are the downsides:

o A game which has officially been declared casual-friendly like WoW, EverQuest 2, and Lord of the Rings Online (if you doubt me, just read the press releases). I, for one, have had quite enough of casual-friendly games.

o The graphics of AoC look sub-par, at least judging from the screenshots and videos on the official web page of the game. Certainly nothing that could touch Vanguard there.

o The twitch-based gameplay.

o Less than inspiring tank classes. A raid main tank with pike specialization? A tank running around with a banner in a dungeon?


Being able to sit on a horse, as opposed to standing on your feet, while swinging your sword is really important to you?

Hmm thats funny since AoC will be DX10, and they only have one DX10 video out there. All the Sshots are DX9 as well. Oh and you can run the game if you can run Oblivion. So wait... my comp that cannot run VG can run AoC! Nice! 5points right there!

Gameplay isn't twitch. Its still dice rolls when it all boils down. Take kiting for example. You have a cone protruding out from your toon. You run in circles, and at the same time making sure your cone lines up with the enemy(s). In killzone stance the ranger gets a wider cone and a faster rate of fire, and in sniping stance the ranger looks like an FPS where he aims his reticle at the mobs.

Less than inspiring tank classes? How about player collision buddy? Have a narrow hallway? Your TANK CAN BLOCK MOBS FROM WALKING THROUGH HIM. Forget the classes, TANKING IN GENERAL will be a breath of fresh air, actually using YOUR VERY BODY to tank with.

It will be casual friendly because of BGs and the like. End-game there is so much to do that isn't casual friendly. Siege warfare. Player cities. Mass PvP. Raiding. You know whats funny? They showcased a raiding dungeon before a reg. PvE dungeon... hilarious! Something vanguard never did. I will be raiding in AoC before Vanguard gets some 24man content!

And this DX9 pic looks soo lame, I mean lets get real and have some graphics that can actually run on peoples computers. You can defend Vanguard when its performance doesn't kill it... oh wait it already did.

[Vaxer]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

Vanguard doesn't offer anything new to the MMO scheme now that we know what the true Vanguard is.

AoC at least offers skill-based combat, nudity, fatality moves, and other never before done in an MMO before.

Oh and mounted combat ftw!

LOL. You are obviously too young to know what you are talking about. Where you in the VG Beta as well? A couple months down the road you will be bitching about AoC just like this.

See, its a giant circle you traverse.

1. You get into a game with your UbErZ guild. Talk like its the best thing since sliced bread in the MMO scene.
2. You RUSH to lvl cap...again because your UbErZ.
3. You cant stop talking about your L337 skills...and even make a sig with a pic of your character or something uber you did in game.
4. You finish alot of of the end game content...way early because you UbErz.
5. Like EVERY game, MMO or not, before things can get added you start to bitch. Cry. Moan.
6. You and your UbErZ guild are quitting because nothing is a challenge, you are bored, you can 2 man everything in the game...and the devs should be heartbroken your UbErZ self and guild keep threating to "Leave".
7. You start posting how you were the biggest supporter of VG...and you are "sad" you have to leave...but bitch about the game anyway.
8. Defend yourself with RL instances to people that dont and wont ever know you in RL. exp: I am the smartest guy ever! I do have a LIFE!! I have a real female....REALLY!!(Hell...nm this one just re-read your post above about your RL for a prime example of someone feeling the need to compensate.)
9. Move on to next MMO with an UbErZ guild.....dont forget to keep posting on the "boring and tired MMO" about how you are moving to the next game, and how its "better than sliced bread".
10. Repeat steps 1-9 over.

Fact is...I been there done that. Then I grew up.

[Cobalty2004]

Originally Posted by Vaxer

LOL. You are obviously too young to know what you are talking about. Where you in the VG Beta as well? A couple months down the road you will be bitching about AoC just like this.

See, its a giant circle you traverse.

1. You get into a game with your UbErZ guild. Talk like its the best thing since sliced bread in the MMO scene.
2. You RUSH to lvl cap...again because your UbErZ.
3. You cant stop talking about your L337 skills...and even make a sig with a pic of your character or something uber you did in game.
4. You finish alot of of the end game content...way early because you UbErz.
5. Like EVERY game, MMO or not, before things can get added you start to bitch. Cry. Moan.
6. You and your UbErZ guild are quitting because nothing is a challenge, you are bored, you can 2 man everything in the game...and the devs should be heartbroken your UbErZ self and guild keep threating to "Leave".
7. You start posting how you were the biggest supporter of VG...and you are "sad" you have to leave...but bitch about the game anyway.
8. Defend yourself with RL instances to people that dont and wont ever know you in RL. exp: I am the smartest guy ever! I do have a LIFE!! I have a real female....REALLY!!(Hell...nm this one just re-read your post above about your RL for a prime example of someone feeling the need to compensate.)
9. Move on to next MMO with an UbErZ guild.....dont forget to keep posting on the "boring and tired MMO" about how you are moving to the next game, and how its "better than sliced bread".
10. Repeat steps 1-9 over.

Fact is...I been there done that. Then I grew up.

Nope not like that. See in VG there was no content to keep my guild and I occupied. AoC will have more than enough.

I played VG beta since 3 if that means anything.

And as long as there is ONE reason to log in at level cap i will be happy.

Being in engineering school full-time, I can find something else to do if needbe.

[Vaxer]

Originally Posted by Cobalty2004

Nope not like that. See in VG there was no content to keep my guild and I occupied. AoC will have more than enough.

I played VG beta since 3 if that means anything.

And as long as there is ONE reason to log in at level cap i will be happy.

Being in engineering school full-time, I can find something else to do if needbe.

You are doing well in your steps! Keep pumping AoC on VG boards! Also, good job on mentioning your Engineering school! Although not as impressive as medical school, or rocket science, it justifies that "you are cool in RL". Migh want to add you have a hot g/f too...it will only help.

Also I will reply to the IM you sent me as well:

"""You know nothing about me, so just please shut the **** up.

You also know nothing about my guild, so just please shut the **** up.

You know nothing of what Vanguard was supposed to be, and what a huge dissappointment it was, but you are to busy enjoying that piece of shit game? So shut the **** up!

I said Good-day!

~Fraktal
__________________
-Future Assassin-
Halcyon Affinity (AoC)
HA 4 Life! """

Oh I do know you! You are in Engineering school. You are in a uberz guild that got nothing but server firsts (lol). You maintained a female while in your uberz raiding guild. You hate VG now. You like Conan now.

Oh, how can you I dont know you.....your breaking my heart.

Now, keep your steps going! You are doing well.

[Venge]

This is a very entertaining thread indeed...
So I have a one year subscription? What does that make me...